Jeanna, I enjoyed this so much! Thanks, Amanda, for facilitating this. As an astrologer, Jeanna will understand this-- THANK GOODNESS that Capricorns age backwards. What a relief it is to age into that, finally.
I was such a voracious, escapist reader as a kid. Meg in A Wrinkle in Time taught me that you could be angry and awkward and still deeply, deeply loved. Mary in A Secret Garden taught me about the incredible healing power of the natural world and getting your hands in the dirt. And Pecola Breedlove of The Bluest Eye taught me that I wasn't alone.
Confession: That first question above is really from me/for me. I'm really interested in hearing how writers can let the nourishment of astrology come into our writing practices, especially if we were raised in more (ahem) skeptical environments. :)
I'm so glad you said that about Ella Enchanted! I've never read the book but watched the movie every time and I *know* it's because that dynamic of having built-in forced obedience that you have to finally believe in yourself to overcome speaks to me so strongly. What a great interview to read, thank you both!
Well, I have to now! I didn't even realize it was a book, I'm chagrined to say. Looking forward to it!
(Randomly, this reminds me of the first time I ever read Mary Poppins as a kid. I wonder if anyone else has ever read that book? It is NOTHING like the movie.)
As a fellow former-evangelical I’m curious about how the transition from evangelical spirituality to astrology has felt. In particular, evangelical spirituality felt a lot like scanning my environment for “signs” from god, rather than listening to my inner self. Did astrology ever have echoes of that for you, or has it always been a form of spirituality that connects you to yourself?
I didn't really get into my journey out of the church here because I have talked so much about that ad nauseum over the last year (in my book, in press for my book, at my newsletter, etc.), but it was a long journey and certainly was not directly from church --> the occult. But here is an abbreviated version!
I started reading tarot long before getting into astrology, which has a whole chapter in my memoir, but to me, tarot wasn't really a spiritual practice. It was really just a journal prompt to help me think through things without God. After leaving the church/breaking up with Jesus, I seriously did not know how to process // figure out what I wanted or thought. And pulling tarot cards helped reflect me back to myself. Very much a reconnection/revision of self.
For a long time, anything "spiritual" just felt very charged. But I will also offer, I am not an atheist, never had an atheist phase, in part because I had a staggering number of very profound spiritual experiences growing up. I could always audibly hear spirits. I understand that plenty of people dismiss this and don't believe that that kind of thing happens in the world, but it was my lived experience, and I don't discount it solely because I left Christianity.
So you ask, does astrology have echoes of me scanning for signs of God. On its own, no; to me, astrology is by far the most mundane, practical, cut and dry "occult" thing I do. I don't think it's God or whoever when astrologers observe that a certain category of historical event occurs whenever, for example, Saturn and Pluto meet up in the sky (as they did in 2020, right before COVID); we're just looking at history books and saying "well, anytime these two plants are here, catastrophic world events like wars and pandemics tend to happen." We're the meteorologists.
But astrology does very much put me more into connection with the world around me. What is doing New and Full Moon rituals if not observing the lunar cycle of the moon, and how the world responds to it? And in this, astrology has very much been part of my developing a more animist worldview. And so, do I have other practices, at this point, that utilize some of those skills that baby!me first developed in the church? Yes.
Thank you for writing this out! I’m eager to check out your memoir. I think it was March of this year when I realized I could nourish myself as a spiritual being--as someone who needs connectedness and meaning--even while my theology remains a heap of rubble. My spirituality shifted from figuring out what is “true” and pursuing that with my whole being, to learning my needs as a self-aware animal and what nourishes them.
I haven’t yet explored traditional spiritual practices, but I’m often surprised to learn practices I’ve stumbled into have a rich tradition behind them (for example, encountering the sacred as a black woman who approaches me from behind, or receiving wisdom from my higher self in the voice of an old crone).
Loved this conversation. Thank you. I loved Meg from wrinkle in time (she was confrontational in a way I never could be - multiple trips to the principals office! Horror!) and Jo march of course. ❤️ And I also had a big Joan of arc phase! evangelical girls only had a few women to look up to and they were usually missionaries or martyrs! 😅🙃
Loved this conversation...I adored reading Ella Enchanted and probably read it at least five times, and now it clicks why it resonated with me so much.
No bad questions, right (says the former teacher)? What process would you recommend for finding the right writing support group? I tend to approach these things very very erratically and organically, searching here and there until something resonates and then I grab onto it. But I'm not sure if that's the best process for this need of mine. Any tips?
Jeanna, I enjoyed this so much! Thanks, Amanda, for facilitating this. As an astrologer, Jeanna will understand this-- THANK GOODNESS that Capricorns age backwards. What a relief it is to age into that, finally.
I was such a voracious, escapist reader as a kid. Meg in A Wrinkle in Time taught me that you could be angry and awkward and still deeply, deeply loved. Mary in A Secret Garden taught me about the incredible healing power of the natural world and getting your hands in the dirt. And Pecola Breedlove of The Bluest Eye taught me that I wasn't alone.
A Wrinkle in Time! A Secret Garden! The Bluest Eye! Such special books, all.
Confession: That first question above is really from me/for me. I'm really interested in hearing how writers can let the nourishment of astrology come into our writing practices, especially if we were raised in more (ahem) skeptical environments. :)
I'm so glad you said that about Ella Enchanted! I've never read the book but watched the movie every time and I *know* it's because that dynamic of having built-in forced obedience that you have to finally believe in yourself to overcome speaks to me so strongly. What a great interview to read, thank you both!
Oh man. I have seen the movie. I EXHORT you to read the book, it is so much better! And SO DIFFERENT.
Well, I have to now! I didn't even realize it was a book, I'm chagrined to say. Looking forward to it!
(Randomly, this reminds me of the first time I ever read Mary Poppins as a kid. I wonder if anyone else has ever read that book? It is NOTHING like the movie.)
As a fellow former-evangelical I’m curious about how the transition from evangelical spirituality to astrology has felt. In particular, evangelical spirituality felt a lot like scanning my environment for “signs” from god, rather than listening to my inner self. Did astrology ever have echoes of that for you, or has it always been a form of spirituality that connects you to yourself?
I didn't really get into my journey out of the church here because I have talked so much about that ad nauseum over the last year (in my book, in press for my book, at my newsletter, etc.), but it was a long journey and certainly was not directly from church --> the occult. But here is an abbreviated version!
I started reading tarot long before getting into astrology, which has a whole chapter in my memoir, but to me, tarot wasn't really a spiritual practice. It was really just a journal prompt to help me think through things without God. After leaving the church/breaking up with Jesus, I seriously did not know how to process // figure out what I wanted or thought. And pulling tarot cards helped reflect me back to myself. Very much a reconnection/revision of self.
For a long time, anything "spiritual" just felt very charged. But I will also offer, I am not an atheist, never had an atheist phase, in part because I had a staggering number of very profound spiritual experiences growing up. I could always audibly hear spirits. I understand that plenty of people dismiss this and don't believe that that kind of thing happens in the world, but it was my lived experience, and I don't discount it solely because I left Christianity.
So you ask, does astrology have echoes of me scanning for signs of God. On its own, no; to me, astrology is by far the most mundane, practical, cut and dry "occult" thing I do. I don't think it's God or whoever when astrologers observe that a certain category of historical event occurs whenever, for example, Saturn and Pluto meet up in the sky (as they did in 2020, right before COVID); we're just looking at history books and saying "well, anytime these two plants are here, catastrophic world events like wars and pandemics tend to happen." We're the meteorologists.
But astrology does very much put me more into connection with the world around me. What is doing New and Full Moon rituals if not observing the lunar cycle of the moon, and how the world responds to it? And in this, astrology has very much been part of my developing a more animist worldview. And so, do I have other practices, at this point, that utilize some of those skills that baby!me first developed in the church? Yes.
A very long answer to your question.
Thank you for writing this out! I’m eager to check out your memoir. I think it was March of this year when I realized I could nourish myself as a spiritual being--as someone who needs connectedness and meaning--even while my theology remains a heap of rubble. My spirituality shifted from figuring out what is “true” and pursuing that with my whole being, to learning my needs as a self-aware animal and what nourishes them.
I haven’t yet explored traditional spiritual practices, but I’m often surprised to learn practices I’ve stumbled into have a rich tradition behind them (for example, encountering the sacred as a black woman who approaches me from behind, or receiving wisdom from my higher self in the voice of an old crone).
Loved this conversation. Thank you. I loved Meg from wrinkle in time (she was confrontational in a way I never could be - multiple trips to the principals office! Horror!) and Jo march of course. ❤️ And I also had a big Joan of arc phase! evangelical girls only had a few women to look up to and they were usually missionaries or martyrs! 😅🙃
Jo March! Oh, how could I forget. I even have a whole essay about her (lol).
I actually never had a Joan of Arc phase, but god, so many exvangelical girls did, didn't they? The martyr thing - so real.
Yes, I mostly *didnt* want to die for god but the archetype of gender nonconforming warrior prophet was pretty great I guess 😅
Loved this conversation...I adored reading Ella Enchanted and probably read it at least five times, and now it clicks why it resonated with me so much.
Yes yes! It's so powerful! Ella Enchanted hive, rise up!
Ella Enchanted hive rise!!! We exist!!!
WE ARE HERE AND WE ARE QUEER
Yay, so happy to see two of my favourite writers in one place!
No bad questions, right (says the former teacher)? What process would you recommend for finding the right writing support group? I tend to approach these things very very erratically and organically, searching here and there until something resonates and then I grab onto it. But I'm not sure if that's the best process for this need of mine. Any tips?